Jim Camp

Ask a silly question, you get a dopey look

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A few weeks back, in a moment of weakness, I answered a question in an online copywriting forum.

In my answer, I mentioned negotiation coach Jim Camp, the guy who (among his other accomplishments) revamped the FBI’s negotiation strategy.

Now here’s the thing. Even though full access to Jim Camp’s methods and coaching (while he was alive) cost thousands of dollars in fees, the man also wrote a book called Start With No, which covers about 95% of his negotiation system and costs around $15.

Anyhow, all of this is just setup for what I want to talk about today. Because when I wrote up my response and when I mentioned Jim Camp, another commenter slid in with a new question:

“Where to study Jim Camp? Looking for his education pieces but everything is paid (and expensive). I’m aware of Start With No.”

If this guy were sitting in front of me when he asked this question, I think I’d have to scrunch up my eyebrows, smile a dopey smile, and shrug my shoulders.“I know, buddy. It’s tough.” After all, what else could I tell him?

I bring this up because top direct-response copywriter Roy Furr just shared a very simple, very effective method of getting work with premier copywriting clients.

This method is something I’ve done in the past. It has been responsible for some of the longest-running and most profitable client relationships I’ve had to date.

It’s also something I’m going to start doing again, beginning this week. That’s because I want to pad out my schedule for the coming few months, and increase my rates once again.

And here’s how this ties into studying Jim Camp:

Roy says wannabe copywriters often ask how they can get clients…

And then when they get a valuable, proven suggestion, they do nothing with the information.

Instead, they spin on their heels, face forward once again, and ask, “But how can I land a copywriting client?”

To which the only response can be a dopey look.

Anyways, I’m sure that’s not how you operate.

So in case you want to read Roy’s advice so you can apply it in your copywriting business, here’s where to start:

https://www.breakthroughmarketingsecrets.com/blog/i-was-right-did-you-listen/

You’re okay, I’m about to stew in Old Bay

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I got myself in a bit of a pickle today.

That’s because yesterday, I wrote about smart and effective ways that marketers can use reciprocity to get their prospects’ trust.

I didn’t spell out what those ways were, so I invited people to write in if they wanted to know what I had in mind.

And a few people did exactly that.

Only one problem.

While I had vague ideas of effective reciprocity that I’ve seen in marketing, I hadn’t really thought deeply about this issue.

And I certainly didn’t have a list of such strategies prepared and ready to share.

This was weighing on me earlier today.

I was starting to get more nervous than a crab next to a pot of boiling water and a can of Old Bay Seasoning.

So to take my mind off this troubling situation, I put on a lesson from a course by negotiation expert Jim Camp.

This lesson talked about one of the pillars of Jim Camp’s negotiation philosophy:

The idea that everybody wants to “be okay.”

This means feeling comfortable.

And the main way we humans do this is by being a little more okay than the other person.

So if you want to make people feel okay, you can do so by being “unokay” — by revealing your mistakes, uncertainties, or foibles.

Once you trust your adversaries — or prospects — in this way, they will begin to let their guard down…

Start to trust you a little more in turn…

And look for ways to help you out.

This is powerful stuff. And in my experience, it works very well.

Unfortunately, it’s also something I have to constantly remind myself of.

Because my first instinct is to try to impress everyone with my smarts, my preparedness, or my skills.

Anyways, perhaps you can see where I’m going with this. And maybe you will get some use out of it.

For now, if you want to get some copy written, and you’re not too bothered by my occasional unpreparedness, then write me an email and we can talk.

Dirty deeds done at premium, non-negotiable rates

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Here’s a little story to warm you up:

“There are two bums sitting on a park bench. They had just woken up from a long night’s winter sleep covered up with newspapers. And the one bum had found a butt of a cigar on the ground. As he was lighting it, he said, ‘You know Bill, one good thing they can say about us is we always have the lowest price in town.'”

This story comes from Jim Camp, one of the world’s most influential philosophers of negotiation.

So what’s Camp’s point?

Well, let me tell you using Camp’s own words. First, here’s Camp’s thinking when he’s on the buying side:

“If you want people to be responsible, all you have to do is pay their asking price. Once you begin to cut their price or drive their price down, if there’s any glitches of failures, it’s your fault. [The other side can just say,] “I’m finding out I can’t deliver what I thought I could.'”

Maybe you’re not impressed with Camp’s unwillingness to haggle. In that case, prepare to be shocked, because Camp is unwilling to haggle in either direction. Here are his thoughts when he’s on the selling side:

“I have a price when I’m selling, and my price is never compromised. […] Everything I deliver is personal service. And if I discount that, I don’t like myself. I don’t feel good about what I’m doing. If I don’t like myself and what I’m doing then I’m not going to perform to my highest level of capability.”

So is Jim Camp right? Or wrong?

I think it’s really a question of what kind of business you want to run, and what kinds of people you want to deal with.

I personally don’t like haggling, and I don’t like working with people who do.

That’s why my attitude from the start of my copywriting career has never been, “Dirty deeds, done dirt cheap.”

Instead, it’s been, “Dirty deeds, done at premium, non-negotiable rates.”

Of course, I’ve had to improve my skills along the way in order to justify my ever-increasing rates. The surprising thing is, the more I charge, the more value I wind up delivering to clients.

Just something to think about when you’re thinking of discounting your own prices.

And here’s something else to think about:

I’m generally fully booked up with client work these days, because I have 3 clients with ongoing projects and never-ending need for copy.

In other words, I’m not hungry for more client work.

But I also want to keep in touch with potential new clients. So I’ve set aside two one-hour slots each month to talk to clients, share whatever advice I can, and see if it makes sense for us to work together.

I haven’t yet automated this whole process, but if you’re interested in taking me up on one of these two slots for the month of April, you can get started by taking me up on the following offer:

https://bejakovic.com/profitable-health-emails/

How to sell lousy rotten garbage

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“HOT”

That’s the headline of a famous ad written by Joe Sugarman some time back in the 1970’s.

The ad was for a membership program called Consumers Hero — basically a mail-order catalogue of refurbished goods such as clock radios and digital watches.

Sugarman used the “HOT” concept to suck people in — the idea was that this stuff was so cheap that it was basically like stealing from the manufacturers.

And that’s not the only clever idea in this piece of copy.

For example, there’s also how old Joe addressed an objection that the reader was sure to have earlier on. The objection being:

“Sure, the refurbished clock radio might be cheap, but isn’t it junk?”

To which Joe says, of course it is!

In fact, as Joe walks you through Consumers Hero and its service, he uses the phrase “lousy rotten” six times to describe their merchandise. At one point, he even refers to it as “garbage.”

This is something that famed negotiation coach Jim Camp used to call the “negative stripline.””

In effect, it’s when you take a more negative position that the person you’re negotiating with (or selling to).

This disarms much of your adversary’s negativity.

And it can even cause him to try to bring you to a more neutral position.

“Lousy rotten garbage? It can’t be that bad! Tell me more about it, and I’ll see if I want one.”

And of course, Joe does tell you. All about how the money and care that goes into refurbishing the lousy rotten clock radio, into testing it, and in making sure that you’re perfectly satisfied when you get it and use, including a five-year warranty.

So what’s the point?

If your prospects are sure to have an objection, don’t shy away from it.

Beat them to it.

And even make a joke out of it.

And then, end on a less negative note. Such as:

If you have lousy rotten garbage on your hands (just kidding!) and you’re trying to offload it onto your customers, you might like the email marketing lessons found here:

https://bejakovic.com/profitable-health-emails/

Man brutally accuses woman of wearing 1980’s outfit

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One time, I was walking down the street when I saw a pretty girl.

I ran up to her, and I said, “Hello. I wanted to tell you that you look very nice.”

The girl looked at me coldly and said, “Thank you.” She seemed suspicious and ready to move on right away.

So what to do? How to keep the conversation going for a bit? Should I ask her where’s she’s from? Or what she does for a living? Or what her plans are for the rest of the day?

Nope.

I think all those things would have made the girl more defensive still, and would have sent her packing as soon as she gave me a curt answer.

So instead, I took a different tack and I said:

“I’ll tell you what I noticed about you. I thought you looked very elegant on top” — here I gestured with my open hand from the girl’s head down across her body — “like you work in a fancy law office. But there’s one thing that doesn’t seem to match.”

The girl’s eyes opened wide at this point. I continued:

“It’s these big white sneakers you’re wearing. They give you a 1980’s, Melanie Griffith, Working Girl kind of look.”

The girl started laughing — and she started to talk. No, it’s not a 1980’s look. She has an extra pair of flats in her bag, just it’s so cold outside so she changed into sneakers. And it’s not a law office where she works, but a graphic design studio.

Now that’s something I can work with. But why do I bring this story up?

Well, for the past 4 days, I’ve been talking about alternatives to asking crappy, yes-seeking questions. One of these alternatives was to ask open-ended questions, in the style of negotiation expert Jim Camp.

The thing is, there are situations where the other side is so cold that asking them any kind of question doesn’t work. It doesn’t get you any kind of useful information. It doesn’t get them engaged. And very likely, it kills the interaction.

So what’s the alternative?

Well, it’s to take the advice of pick up artists such as Wayne Elise AKA Juggler — and do what I did in the story above. Simply call out what you see. In other words, make assumptions and verbalize them.

The magical thing is, you don’t need to be right.

Of course, if you’re on a sales call rather than talking to a girl on the street, you don’t want to seem frivolous. But even if you make an assumption that turns out to be incorrect, odds are good that your adversary will jump in to correct you — which is a big step forward, because now you have something to work with.

Anyways, this is the fourth and final alternative I have to asking yes-seeking questions. Tomorrow I’ll be back to more traditional copywriting and marketing topics.

For now, if you want my thoughts on how to apply assumptions to email marketing, specifically for the health space, check out my upcoming book:

https://bejakovic.com/profitable-health-emails/

The yellow balloon sales principle

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I saw a tense dog-man standoff at a park near my house.

The dog, a German boxer, was on top of a little hill. The man, the dog’s owner, was at the bottom of the hill, calling to the dog to come down.

The dog stared and didn’t move. The man called again. The dog continued to stare.

Eventually, the man started to walk away. The dog still kept his spot on top of the hill, and didn’t budge.

And then, as the man was walking away, he slowly took out a bright yellow object from his pocket. The dog started charging full speed down the hill. The man put the yellow object to his lips and started to blow. (It turned out to be a balloon.)

The dog was there in a second, bouncing up and down as the man held the balloon just above the height that the dog could reach.

Now for the past few days, I’ve been writing about alternatives to asking yes-seeking questions. So far, I talked about vision-building questions and no-seeking questions — both of them based on what negotiation expert Jim Camp used to teach.

Well, today I have something out of the playbook of email marketing guru Ben Settle. In fact, it’s something I’ve talked about in this blog already. It’s what I called Ben’s “sink-or-swim” close. That’s when you tell your prospect something like:

“If you don’t believe this technology/service/information can help you be more competitive, then simply don’t buy it.”

And then you wait and allow them to make a decision.

Of course, you have to do a good job painting a vision before you do this. And as Ben likes to say, you have to do it on principle, rather than as a tactic. In other words, you have to be confident you’ve got a good offer, and you have to accept that even so, some people still won’t buy.

Not everyone is right for your offer and that’s ok. Because when you find a prospect who’s right for your offer, you’ll see something like I saw at the park.

They’ll think. They’ll stare. And they’ll start to move. Next thing you know, they’ll be charging down the hill towards that big yellow balloon you’ve put in front of their face, and you will soon have a sale.

At least, that’s how it worked with me in the case of the sales letter that Ben sent.

Anyways, if you don’t need sales emails like this written for your business, then, you know, that’s ok. Otherwise, you can get an idea of how to write them yourself, with a free copy of my upcoming book on email marketing for the health space. More info here:

https://bejakovic.com/profitable-health-emails/

Overweight passenger forces flight attendants to wipe his butt

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This one comes from Monday’s New York Post:

“An overweight passenger aboard a Taiwanese airliner forced flight attendants to remove his pants so he could use the toilet — then wipe his butt as he moaned in pleasure, according to reports.”

Yes, it really happened. The question is how.

How exactly does one grown human being force another human being to wipe his butt?

After all, there are frequently plain-clothes police or air marshals on board planes to deal with rowdy passengers. And even if not, a team of flight attendants can subdue a single passenger, even an overweight one.

The fact is, this passenger didn’t use force to get his butt wiped. The only option that’s left then is a kind of nuclear persuasion.

Here’s how it apparently went down:

The man asked for assistance using the lavatory.

The flight attendants refused.

The man then dropped his pants and threatened to relieve himself on the floor.

That seemed to soften up the flight attendants a little, and the man was helped into the lavatory. One thing led to another, and a couple of latex gloves later, the man was moaning in pleasure as a female flight attendant wiped his butt for him.

Now this is a pretty gruesome and shocking story. I’m retelling it because I’m hoping it will make the following point stick in your mind.

It’s again something from top negotiation coach Jim Camp (I’ve written about him often), and it’s in continuation of the “don’t look for a YES” emails I’ve written over the past few days.

You see, Camp’s big thing was trying to get people to tell him NO. In fact, he even wrote a couple of books on the subject, one of them being, “Start with NO.”

According to Camp, it’s only when people say “no” that they make a real decision. A “yes” doesn’t mean much, and “maybe” is even worse.

So what does this have to do with the above story?

Well, there’s a powerful vision created when a 440-pound passenger drops his pants on a plane and effectively says, “Do you want me to take a shit right here?”

It’s possible that some people would say “maybe” or “yes” to this. The flight attendants in question apparently didn’t, and their saying NO allowed the man to get what he wanted.

Can this same approach work for you?

That’s going to depend on the question you’re asking. And who you’re talking to.

For example, if I ask you if you need help with your sales emails, how might you respond?

You might tell me NO. And I’d be happy to hear it, because I’d know you’re not interested in my offer, so I should focus my energy elsewhere.

​You might tell me MAYBE, in which case I wouldn’t pursue the conversation any further.

However, you might also say YES. Which, as Camp would tell you, is far from meaning you will like my upcoming book on email marketing for the health space. But it does mean you might be interested in getting notified when it comes out. That’s because if you sign up now, you can get your copy for free.

If that’s what you want to do, here’s where to go:

https://bejakovic.com/profitable-health-emails/

Good Will Camping

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Yesterday, I ragged on yes-seeking questions.

Today, I want to offer up an alternative — one of four I’ll be covering over the next few days. And to do that, let’s talk Good Will Hunting.

That’s the flick that put Matt Damon on the map in the role of Will Hunting, the supernaturally talented math genius from the slums of Boston who literally mops the floors at MIT.

The relevant scene for us is when Will is sitting opposite a shrink named Sean Maguire (played by Robin Williams).

Shrink Maguire is trying to draw Will out of his shell. “You can do anything,” the shrink seems to be saying, “so take advantage of your opportunities.”

Will gets defensive about this. He says how there’s nothing wrong with doing manual labor or with mopping floors — there’s even honor in it.

Shrink Maguire doesn’t argue with this. He doesn’t say, “Yeah, but…” He also doesn’t ask, “Isn’t there more honor in being a world-renowned scientist?”

Instead, he simply asks,

“You could be a janitor anywhere. Why did you choose to work in the most prestigious technical college in the whole fucking world?”

This causes Will to pause. And it slowly but surely sets off something in his head, which leads to the movie’s eventual happy ending.

So what happened?

Well, the point of asking that question was not to one-up Will’s smarts, or to trap him in a lie. At least not if you listen to master negotiation coach Jim Camp, whose playbook this question comes straight out of.

Camp advocated asking open-ended questions. The point of this was to “build vision” — to make the other side clearly see their own dire situation in their own minds.

It’s the only way to convince people of anything, Camp believed. And with his track record of successful billion-dollar negotiations in some of the most competitive business markets in the world, Camp probably knew what he was talking about.

Anyways, this idea of creating vision applies to in-person sales, and it applies to sales copywriting as well. Not necessarily in the form of asking open-ended questions. But creating a vision — such as by retelling a scene from a movie — is a very powerful way to drive home a point and to make the sale.

Speaking of which, if you need help with sales copy, you might like the ideas in my upcoming book on email marketing for the health space. This lays out the techniques I’ve used to triple (yep, 3x) sales from an email sales funnel for an 8-figure supplement company. To get notified when this book is out, sign up below:

https://bejakovic.com/profitable-health-emails/

The salutary effect of paying for traffic

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Right now, I’m running a paid Facebook ad campaign.

It’s promoting a lead magnet for my aromatherapy website, titled The Little Black Book of Essential Oil Scams.

I don’t know much about running ads on Facebook, but it seems like I’m getting leads for pretty cheap. On the other hand, they don’t seem to be the highest-quality leads — many people who opt in never even download the lead magnet.

But that’s ok.

Because the very fact of paying for traffic is having a salutary effect on me.

I got that phrase from negotiation master Jim Camp, who talked about “the salutary effect of cold calling.” When you cold call, Camp used to say, you have no expectations, and you have a great opportunity to eliminate all your neediness (one of the main pillars of Camp’s negotiation system).

Well, paying for traffic doesn’t have the same salutary effect.

But it does make me want to write emails every day to these leads. What’s more, it makes me want to write emails that get read and get people stirred up. In other words, I’m no longer just writing for the sake of being able to say I’ve done it. Instead, I’m writing to make sales.

That’s both because I’m spending money on traffic now (rather than counting on an indefinite stream of leads from Google)…

And it’s also because it becomes a game — can I make back the money that I will spend on ads, so I can do this all over again on a bigger scale?

Speaking of games, I’m running another ad campaign, and that’s on Amazon.

I’m promoting the aromatherapy books I have .

And once I finish up my new book, about being a successful freelancer on Upwork, I’ll put it up on Amazon, and promote it through ads as well.

However, before I do that, I will probably take advantage of Amazon’s free promotion period. This means, for a few days, once the book is published, it will be available to download for free.

In case you want to get notified when this happens, sign up below, and I’ll keep you in the loop:

https://bejakovic.com/upwork-book-notification-list/

Cross-dressing for negotiation success

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“No, I wear men’s suits. I got this out of a bin.”
— Michael Scott, Dunder Mifflin Inc.

Here’s an inadvertent but brilliant negotiation lesson from the TV show The Office:

Michael Scott, the regional manager, is about to have a salary negotiation with one of his employees, Darryl. Michael is dreading the negotiation, and he’s preparing with some awful negotiation tactics he got from Wikipedia. But when the actual negotiation starts, it all falls apart quickly.

Darryl states his demands.

Michael lamely tries to refuse, and then:

Darryl notices that Michael is wearing “lady clothes.”

Could it really be that Michael is dressed in a Hillary-like women’s pant suit?

Let’s see.

The buttons are on the wrong side.

There are no pockets on the pants.

And the label inside the jacket reveals it’s made by the MISSterious label.

The thing is, though unintentional, this is straight out of the book of expert negotiation coach Jim Camp.

One of Camp’s tenets was:

In a negotiation, only one person can feel unokay, and that person is you.

In other words, contrary to conventional wisdom, you don’t want to dominate or lord over the other person when you negotiate. Not if you want a negotiation outcome that sticks. Instead, you want to make the other person feel okay — with themselves, and with the interaction.

One way to do this is to be unokay yourself.

For example, by accidentally dropping your papers all over the floor.

Or forgetting your briefcase at home and asking for a pen and paper.

Or, as Michael did, by inadvertently dressing in a women’s pant suit.

Does it work?

Camp used to swear by it. And by the end of the The Office episode, Michael winds up getting a raise for both himself and Darryl. As he says, “win-win-win.”

Personally, I haven’t tried these unokay gambits myself. But the underlying message — make the other person feel okay — is something I regularly use when talking to potential Upwork clients, and it’s served me well.

If you want to know more about my Upwork strategy, including how I got to be a top-rated sales copywriter on the site and how I get paid $150/hr, then sign up below. I’m currently putting together a book about my Upwork experience,  and if you sign up, I’ll let you know when the book is out. Here’s the link:

https://bejakovic.com/upwork-book-notification-list/